November 2018 Playthrough - Bioshock

[MetalFRO]

I must really suck at FPS games. That, or I just suck at this one. I expected DOOM to give me trouble, but I’m getting my backside handed to me frequently in this game. Between Big Daddies overpowering me, to getting mobbed by multiple enemies that respawn when I do, I find myself having to really watch my ammunition levels pretty carefully. Now that I’ve unlocked a couple extra plasmid slots, and can juggle more powers, I think I might have a better chance of getting a leg up on the hazards, but man, this game is definitely giving me what for.

[zophar53]

I just wanted to give a heads up that some of you guys may want to make some strategic save files while in the Fort Frolic area. I just encountered a glitch during a particular spot that has basically made it so that I cannot progress any further, and I believe my only recourse now is to restart the entire area from my autosave and lose over an hour of progress. After doing some searching, this appears to be a fairly common problem and is not specific to any game version or platform.

Thanks for the heads-up about the glitch. I'm playing the remaster on Steam too, and while I haven't had any issues yet it's nice to have a warning just in case.

I'm past the first checkpoint and am pleased at how well it holds up, atmosphere-wise. My favorite thing about this game is its world-building and sense of ambiance. The art deco architecture, the music, the strung out behavior of the splicers, the intimdating Big Daddies, and the super creepy Little Sisters, it all adds up to one of the most engrossing games I've ever played. I love just randomly looking out a big window at the sprawling underwater city. It's really impressive how well they sell the environment.

I don't really have any trouble buying into the story. It's a little erratically told, yes, but it's a slow burn approach to story telling. A big part of the fun for me was coming into this city that clearly used to be grand but has gone to hell and filling in the context of the characters. Audio logs themselves don't make much sense in a real world practical way, but when done well as a story telling device they're a neat way to fill in backstory and give depth to what's going on.

I must really suck at FPS games. That, or I just suck at this one. I expected DOOM to give me trouble, but I’m getting my backside handed to me frequently in this game. Between Big Daddies overpowering me, to getting mobbed by multiple enemies that respawn when I do, I find myself having to really watch my ammunition levels pretty carefully. Now that I’ve unlocked a couple extra plasmid slots, and can juggle more powers, I think I might have a better chance of getting a leg up on the hazards, but man, this game is definitely giving me what for.

I didn't find this game as difficult as Doom, but I think that has a lot to do with the fact that Doom is much more fast-paced. I took a much slower approach to the BioShock games. Resource management can def be a thing, but I find that if I'm meticulous about searching every nook and cranny and scouring everywhere for health, eve hypos, and ammo I don't really have too many problems. The fact that I enjoyed the world-building of Rapture so much meant that I didn't mind taking a more meandering pace. The Big Daddies can be rough though. Been a while since I played any of the later levels, but I seem to remember even the later ones being a knock down drag out fight regardless of having better weapons and plasmids at your disposal. But I could be misremembering.

Like the rest of you, I tend to not like abusing the vita-chambers to proceed either, but it's nice knowing I won't be losing much (if any) ground if I get overpowered. And yeah, hacking everything you possibly can is a big help too, since you can get the security system stuff working for you instead of against you. Just be careful in the later levels. The later hacking parts include more frequent red squares and it's possible to get trapped if you don't reveal the tiles early enough to plan your route around them.

[MetalFRO]

I guess I need to learn to do more hacking. My problem is, the stuff flows so fast, it’s hard to keep up. However, now that I’ve got the hypnosis ability, to control the Big Daddies, that helps somewhat. The freaking beehive section was a nightmare, but the ability to bring a BD with me, to help keep splicers occupied, was a helpful thing. I have to agree about the atmosphere, the Art Deco style, the period music, and the voice acting is very good for the recordings. They evoke that period feel that helps sell them, despite the somewhat ridiculous premise. The game certainly keeps me on my toes, and sometimes has me in some fairly intense “oh crap” moments, like waiting for the compound to finish. That’s another situation where a BD comes in handy.

[Crabmaster2000]

Finished the second check point now.  While this checkpoint seemed longer than the last one I don't feel like I've progressed the story really at all. Just seemed like busy work to open a bunch of doors. But I very well could have just missed what is happening. I honestly cannot pay attention to an audio log or radio transmission and play the game at the same time, just don't seem to be able to multi-task like that. All the sudden I've got to collect some water and chlorophyll and I have no idea why I'm doing that.

Gameplay-wise though I feel like during this second chapter things are a lot easier than during the first area. I'm constantly finding that I'm maxing out my ammo, EVE Shots and money to the point that I'm purposely spending and shooting at everything just so I can pick up the next drops I find. Having 3-4 slots in all of my improvements is making a huge difference as well. Big Daddies are no longer an issue with Bolt Shells, Armor Piercing Ammo, Frag Grenades and the Chemical Sprayer. And now that I know the Big Daddies will leave you alone unless you initiate combat they are not scary or intimidating at all. You can literally prep yourself and the area to make the combat as favorable as possible before you engage them so it loses that sense of dread that I felt the first time I encountered one. I kind of wish they had used them more like Nemesis from Resident Evil where when you hear those footsteps it's always scary. I totally forgot about the Camera function from the first time I played. It's a neat idea, but it really shines a light on the lack of enemy variety (and honestly I'm finding it pretty hard to distinguish most types of Splicers from each other) and gets very repetitive very quickly, but seems necessary to get the ++ Damage bonus on each enemy. I'm also pretty underwhelmed with the "boss battles" so far. The first Big Daddy fight felt big and meaningful. The 4th clear this room full of splicers and one mildly stronger splicer boss fight is already stale.

At this point in the game, which I'm assuming is halfway, I'm sick of hacking. It's way too easy and they don't seem to be changing it at all so it's just the same thing over and over again. There should be a plasmid that let's you auto-hack anything under a certain level of difficulty. Since I've got so much extra money I keep crafting Auto-Hacking Tools just to speed up that part of the game now.

I really like the initial decent into Rapture and the first area is very spooky and unique. At this point in the game they are still relying heavily on it though so I'm not as in awe at the atmosphere anymore. It's so dark it's hard to appreciate a lot of it and the stuff I can see is just more of the same now. Plus the character models for anything that isn't a Bid Daddy or Little Sister are pretty bad, It's no wonder they don't let you get close to NPCs or have them wear welding masks. I keep running into goofy stuff too like this pic of an arm going through her own head or when I had to return to the lab where the plant doctor died her body was flailing about on the floor like she was having a seizure. And while I'd agree the voice acting is pretty good from what I've actually heard some of the character dialogue has taken me out of the experience. For example when Atlas's family possibly dies in the Submarine explosion he seems obviously sad and then immediately is like "wow you made it to this area now go do this thing" as if nothing had ever happened. And with events like his family dying or Andrew Ryan poisoning the Botanist it really doesnt make me feel anything because I literally just got introduced to the character and havn't had time to make any sort of attachment of judgement of them or in the case of Atlas's family don't have any contact with them at all.

Thanks for the tip on the security cameras earlier. I'm still not catching all of them, but definitely setting off less alarms this time around.

[img width=640 height=480]https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1941/45811616192_d0943df401_z.jpg[/img]

PS - Does anyone else get the impression that your character is 2 feet tall? I feel so close to the ground especially when walking up stairs or looking at the ground or squatting to pick up an item and then back up to full stance. There doesn't seem to be much actual movement to get from the floor to upright. There has been so many times I've felt Oompa Loompa sized.

[zophar53]

For the audio logs I would recommend standing still where you got them to listen to them. That way you don't have to worry about them being cut off by story-triggered dialogue or combat sounds. That's fair about things not changing much throughout the course of the game. Visually it's the same the whole way through. I didn't mind it since I like it so much, but yeah, it doesn't do much new as you progress. Same with the splicers. BioShock does its thing very well, but it is fairly limited in scope.

I didn't have an issue with the lack of traditional boss battles. I consider fighting a Big Daddy a kind of boss battle in my mind and that's enough for me. I also agree about the story and not caring about the people much. There's a reason Atlus acts that way, but this isn't the time for spoilers yet. It didn't bother me not having a connection with the characters I interact with; I was more interested in filling out a picture in my mind of what Rapture used to be, what it looks like now, and filling in the gaps with my imagination about the fall of this great, impossible, flawed achievement of building it.

PS - Does anyone else get the impression that your character is 2 feet tall? I feel so close to the ground especially when walking up stairs or looking at the ground or squatting to pick up an item and then back up to full stance. There doesn't seem to be much actual movement to get from the floor to upright. There has been so many times I've felt Oompa Loompa sized.

Hahaha! I didn't get that feeling mostly, but there are a few places I'm noticing where the angles of looking at something are a little weird.

However, now that I’ve got the hypnosis ability, to control the Big Daddies, that helps somewhat. The freaking beehive section was a nightmare, but the ability to bring a BD with me, to help keep splicers occupied, was a helpful thing.

That's a good idea. I don't think I've ever once hypnotized a Big Daddy in my previous playthroughs. I may do some experimenting this time. I don't think I did any setting up before fighting a Big Daddy either, other than to stock up on health, eve, and ammo. That's not a bad idea. There's a lot of situations that call for that kind of thing in the second game, but I never did it in the first.

I'm curious if people are drinking the alcohol and smoking the cigarettes. On my first playthrough I took it all, regardless of any drunk vision or detriments to my health/eve that came with them. This time I'm avoiding pretty much all that stuff. I can never remember which is good for my health and bad for my eve or vice versa anyway, so I'm choosing to just not even worry about it.

[MetalFRO]

Here's a tip - don't hypnotize one, then attack him. He will immediately be out of his hypnosis, and come at you with a vengeance! I made that mistake already. As for the alcohol, I'm drinking it all, especially when I find a bunch in a room I've cleared out, because each one gives a sliver of health. So if there are several bottles, I'll drink them all in rapid succession, because I haven't found a limit to how much you can drink and then get actually drunk, to where you're incapacitated, just a brief moment of disorientation. Smoking I do as well, but mostly because I tend to rapidly press A and grab everything on a table/countertop/etc., and end up smoking, even though I know it takes away a sliver of health. I just need to be more careful I suppose

[GrayGhost81]

I avoided the cigs and booze, just like in real life. I figured there was plenty of food and health kits everywhere and I was always loaded on eve hypos (this is because I tended to use guns way more than plasmids, though).

I appreciate the spirited conversation here, my friends. I may jump in and play the game again, or at least jump in on one of my saves to mess around.

@Crabby, check out my tips and tricks section about the audio logs. You really just need to stand in one place and listen to them if you want to hear the whole thing, and only grab them when there are not enemies around.

[Crabmaster2000]

I avoided the cigs and booze, just like in real life. I figured there was plenty of food and health kits everywhere and I was always loaded on eve hypos (this is because I tended to use guns way more than plasmids, though).

I appreciate the spirited conversation here, my friends. I may jump in and play the game again, or at least jump in on one of my saves to mess around.

@Crabby, check out my tips and tricks section about the audio logs. You really just need to stand in one place and listen to them if you want to hear the whole thing, and only grab them when there are not enemies around.

I never even contemplated not picking up the booze and cigarettes. I didn't even notice the were hurting you and not helping. I guess I just assumed they would up your EVE or something. May have to lay off going forward.

During my first playthrough I had a lot of trouble with listening to the audio logs too early and getting attacked or having them cut off by some other dialogue, but this time I'm going in like you suggest or doing some light looting/hacking. It's still an issue for me because I'm not particularly engrossed in them so my mind wanders and I still don't get all the info I should have. I'll instead be thinking about where I need to go or "ooo what's that shiny thing over there I can go pick up after they are done talking" or "where the hell is that damn security camera that caught me three times!!". During the first chapter I went into the pause menu and re-listened to a bunch of the tapes that I felt I didn't really hear when I first found them, but I didn't have the patience to do that during the second check point.

I'm beginning to understand that it's likely a me issue and not a design problem. With certain types of games I'm super happy to get engrossed in the story. Give me something like a Quantic Dreams game, or a jRPG and I'm all in to explore the world and read every line of NPC dialoge. Throw in some type of action in though and I feel like I'm a lot more likely to gravitate towards the gameplay mechanics and ignore the lore. I am currently playing Nioh between check points and my son sat down with me a couple days ago and was watching me. After a few minutes he asked me "this looks cool, what's it about?". And my answer was "I dunno, I'm just having fun being an awesome ninja guy". Very similarly when I was playing Dark Souls and talking to Duke.Togo about it he kept telling me all this cool stuff about the lore of the world and these deep character bios that sound really amazing and how many different ways there were to build characters, but I just was so focused on getting to the next boss and playing my thief build like I felt like he should be played that I completely ignored all of that. I think it's quite rare for me to find a game that blends quicker action elements with story that gets me immersed in both aspects. The Batman Arkham series did a good job of that for me and I'm sure there are other examples, but that the only one that jumps immediately to mind. I've beaten Ninja Gaiden over a dozen times and still have no idea what that game is about because I always skip the cutscenes.....

[singlebanana]

YOOOOOOOOOOO!!!  Yep, I'm finally here and joining in on the playthrough. Sorry for my earlier absence, as I am taking care of some personal matters in my life. Anywho, I started the game last night and took out the mad doctor, as Shawn tells me, I'm really close to the first checkpoint.  I haven't fought any Big Daddies yet, but from the looks of things on the forum, that should happen very soon (no real spoiler, since Big Daddies are kind of synonymous with this game).  I'm really enjoying catching up on the forum posts!

Initial thoughts:  The random plane crash/finding Atlantis story mechanic is pretty weak. Perhaps there is some reason that the plane was brought down in this area that I don't know about yet, soooooooooo.....I'll hold my breath until then.  However, once in Rapture, I am really digging the story of this fallen "Utopian" society.  Though I don't have a ton to go on yet, I really enjoy the slow-burn of piecing everything together. This is probably my favorite means of storytelling, so this unlocking of little tidbits as I go, works really well for me.  I like the story recorders and really try and scour an area to find them and tend to pick them up after I've cleared an area to focus on the dialogue.  I can see how that might be aggravating if you are trying to listen in combat, but I think you guys did a nice job of preparing me for that.  Thumbs up so far in terms of the story for me; I'm captivated.

Gameplay for me is a little lackluster, especially after coming off of DOOM (2016).  Not that it's bad, but it feels a bit clunky to me as far as attacking, aiming, and keeping my orientation, especially while in combat. This is pretty much the major issue that keeps me from playing most FPS games. However, it's not terrible and I'm slowly getting better at it. I assume the gameplay will improve further as I gain more implants, equipment, etc. and I'll of course get more accustomed to it. No biggie.  Button layout is okay, but triangle to jump as default is strange. I'm sure that as in most modern games, this can be changed.

The hacking is by far the most annoying feature of this game. I really wish they would switch it up a little with more puzzles and it takes you away from gameplay too long.  The concept is good and I like manipulating enemy machines, I just wish the execution was better. Most of the time I just pay, which is weird.....how does that work? Robots and safes be lovin' some money I guess. And why do vending machines sell ammunition? Perhaps this will also be answered later. One thing I dig is hacking healing devices so that they don't heal and harm your enemies when they try to replenish (sorry Doc!).

I love the look of this game and the art deco style. The music is creepily effective. I love when "innocent" music is used in horror films and it has the totally opposite effect of creeping you the hell out. The music, combined with the slicer dialogue is chilling and pulled off well. The advertising in the environments makes me chuckle sometimes and disturbs me as well, good stuff!

Anyway, just some initial thoughts.  I'm enjoying the game very much so far and will be caught up with you guys soon.

 

[zophar53]

I agree that BioShock feels sluggish coming off of the blazing-fast combat of Doom. I wouldn't necessarily call it slow, but there does feel like there's some weight to moving around. This is definitely a game that's meant to be played at a slower pace to soak in the setting. But yeah, once you have a big arsenal of weapons and plasmids the combat possibilities are pretty fun. Re: the jumping, it didn't bother me as I almost never felt the need to jump. There isn't much verticality to the levels except when you go up or down staircases to up or down a floor.

That's a good idea about hacking the health stations. Typically I just destroy them. When you do that they drop two medkits, so you can heal up without spending money and get an extra one for your stash. Course, you can't use those stations again obviously, but I consider the double medkits a better payoff.

You don't like the hacking??? Who doesn't love a quick round of Pipe Dream!?

The music always reminded me of Fallout. Those games do a similar thing of using old-timey music contrasting with a devastated environment. I've always enjoyed that thematic device for some reason. I remember the old trailers for BioShock really leaning into the creepiness of the environment and strung-out splicers, with the old music behind it. It was the first game I can remember that made me upset I hadn't bought an Xbox 360 yet. At the time I only had a PS3 and the game didn't come to that platform for another year or two.

Here's a tip - don't hypnotize one, then attack him. He will immediately be out of his hypnosis, and come at you with a vengeance! I made that mistake already.

Ah, good tip! I think that's why I almost never hypnotized a Big Daddy; I would hit him once and then he'd snap out of it and show me what for. I never even considered using him to attack the splicers.

[Disposed Hero]

Unless I'm mistaken, I think the alcohol gives a small boost to health and a small decrease to Eve, and vice versa for the cigarettes, so using any of those items is a trade off. Food items give a small health boost, while coffee gives a small Eve boost, and neither of these have any detriments that I've noticed.

I actually really like the hacking minigame, but after doing it literally hundreds of times from hacking everything in sight, it does start to get old after a while. At around the halfway point, I find myself not hacking nearly as much as I was in the early game, although the increased hacking difficulty of the machines contributes to this as well. It would have been nice if different machines had different minigames to add some variety.

I tended to use guns way more than plasmids

I actually had an epiphany the other day that I play this way also. It feels like 99% of my offense comes from my weapons, while I use plasmids almost exclusively for utility purposes. For this reason, I've completely forgone plasmids like Cyclone since I usually don't play the game that way.

Anyway, I took a few days away from the game after the glitch I mentioned previously. I came back to it last night using my autosave at the beginning of Fort Frolic, but I haven't quite gotten back to where I left off, but I'm close. Here's hoping it doesn't bug out on me again!

[singlebanana]

Hey Stephen can you explain the glitch so that we can look out for it. I don't think that that would be a spoiler at this point

[Disposed Hero]

Hey Stephen can you explain the glitch so that we can look out for it. I don't think that that would be a spoiler at this point

There are a couple of times in Fort Frolic when Sander Cohen will lock down the area and send waves of splicers at you, and you have to kill them all to proceed. The first is at the beginning of the area, right after he submerges the bathysphere before unlocking the doors to the atrium. The second is immediately after placing the third photograph on his weird sculpture thing. People have reported the game glitching at both points, but the second point was where it glitched for me. After killing all of the splicers, Cohen should start talking to you again and unlock the doors, but for some reason it doesn't trigger and the sequence will just continue indefinitely even though there are no more enemies to kill.

I've done some searching, and no one seems to know exactly what causes this to happen. Some have said that saving during one of these sequences can somehow screw up the scripting, and coincidentally I did save during the sequence that glitched for me, so there could be some truth to that. It's not a big deal if it glitches during the first part since it's at the very beginning of the area and everyone should have an autosave, but I would recommend making a manual save sometime before placing the third photograph on the sculpture just to be safe.

[singlebanana]

Thanks man!

[MetalFRO]

I actually had an epiphany the other day that I play this way also. It feels like 99% of my offense comes from my weapons, while I use plasmids almost exclusively for utility purposes. For this reason, I've completely forgone plasmids like Cyclone since I usually don't play the game that way.

Interesting. I find that I'm taking a balanced approach. I often use a plasmid to help give me an advantage, such as shocking an enemy, then executing a headshot, or using Incinerate to deal damage and get them distracted, then follow that up with gunfire. That's probably why I find myself buying EVE a fair bit at vending machines.