November 2016 Community Playthrough - Heavy Rain (GAME #100)

[GrayGhost81]

I finished the game today. I'll leave most of my comments until after the last checkpoint, but I changed the way I played based on what GrayGhost had to say and I manged to get two characters killed in the checkpoint 3 chapters and as a result the rest of the game went by a lot faster.

That is hilarious. Heavy casualties in Heavy Rain LOL ☔ ☔ ☔ 💀💀💀

[singlebanana]

You guys are demented..........

[Duke.Togo]

OK, been powering through this in the last few nights, and caught up checkpoint wise. Did the whole club thing and kids grave bit.

Having played the Telltale games before this, I prefer that style to this. If the story is really the main driver (there isn't much "game" here), then I would prefer simpler prompts. I've managed to work my way through them rather well, but even though I get the idea of tying my fingers in knots to try to simulate the characters movements, after a while I get tired of it and just wish I could choose options.

I've managed to keep everyone alive and going well, without much trouble doing the QTEs. Earlier in the game it seemed like what I was doing didn't matter much, but I can see the stakes get higher later on.

As to the characters, the only one I am invested in is Scott. He's well acted, and I enjoy the private eye aspect of the game more from his perspective than I do from Norman's. The traditional approach to hunting down clues and the way he treats Lauren make me really want him to do well. The part with the suicidal mom and baby did a great job at humanizing him. Also, I really liked the part in the clock shop, where you had to remember all the places that you had touched. It had the right level of stress for me, and I probably spent more time than I should have looking everything over, but I think I must have done a decent job because it hasn't come back to bite me yet. Also, I'm not sure if he has a problem with alcohol, but I've been given the impression that he may have struggled with it in the past. I make sure to not let him drink whenever possible. That probably sounds silly, but again, he's the character that I care about.

The other characters leave me feeling very flat. I have reached the point where I don't really even like Ethan anymore and it was rather entertaining making him cut off his finger. The long 5 minute timer was given to make you think hard about it, I'm sure, but I grabbed the knife and alcohol, rinsed his hand off, and whack! I've been tempted to let him die, but I want to see him through his tortures. I've passed each one so far, and just the last one to go through. I thought that he might die when I pushed him off the ledge when the cops were after him, but nope.

The angle with Ethan and Madison really doesn't make any sense to me. I get the part that she wants to get the story, but how did she track him down to the motel in the first place? Did I miss that part? Also, that scene in the creepy doctor's house? Full of nope.There was no way I was going to drink what that nut job gave me. I still can't figure out why she is doing all of these things alone. It makes sense for Ethan to be alone, but for Madison it's just a bad idea.

Good cop and bad cop are probably the worst. I still don't have any idea what kind of drug that Norman is supposed to be on, or why, or how it could kill him. I don't even remember bad cop's name. If there was an option to shoot him I'd probably take it. With Scott doing such a great job in the story of chasing down the real killer, these two knuckle heads are just going to beat up half the town to try to bungle their way into it. Managed to keep Norman alive though, which has been tough. About lost him at the car place, and again when the origami killer came to the club.

Lauren is an odd addition, and while she doesn't do much for me as a character, she does give the opportunity to Scott to shine. The part when she was standing in the rain and you could comfort her was good. I wrapped her up in the coat, and felt like that was just right. I'm not sure if it is possible for something to happen to her or if she is just the default side kick, but I'm alright with her tagging along.

Regarding the nudity, I didn't think much of it until the really weird mannequin sex scene between the two. The shower scenes were just people taking a shower, and I'm not sure that you even really had to make Madison take a shower at all. I do want to give the game big props for letting me use the bathroom at every opportunity, and letting me wash my hands when done.

[Pam]

Duke, I feel about the same with regards to the characters. Ethan's not particularly sympathetic. Obviously he's depressed over losing his son, but at the beginning of the game I kinda wanted to yell at him for not paying more attention to the son who was still alive. While I don't particularly like him, I like his chapters, they're the most exciting and make the most sense from a story point of view. I feel like a lot of the chapters with characters who aren't Ethan seem to come out of nowhere. Like, what brought Scott to that rich guy's party? Why was Madison at the Doctor's house? There's usually some brief mention of a suspect or something but many of these chapters just seem like a half-assed way of introducing another action scene. 

Madison is still one of the worst written and least necessary characters I've seen in a game though. Did it say somewhere that she's chasing the Origami Killer story and I just missed it? I could have sworn she said she was a photographer when she first met Ethan (and they just happened to be checked into the same hotel, she didn't track him down). It seems like she just patches him up and only becomes involved in the game events because of him. I'm not even sure how she got to the Doctor's place - what led her there? How did she know the address of one of the places Ethan had been? Madison died at the Doctor's place in my game. I really had to try and get her killed though. I didn't drink, but I did get knocked out and tied to a table. I had one chance to get out while he answered the door. Then a second chance as he answered the door again. Finally when he was chasing me around the room he planted the buzz saw into her back. Then I got to watch an overly long scene of him fondling her corpse and laughing maniacally. Yuck.

[Duke.Togo]

Pam, like you I can't figure out how on earth Madison is supposed to know about Ethan. I have to conclude that she just really does go to motels to deal with her insomnia and just the story of the century just fell directly into her lap. As to how she found the doctor, at the very beginning of that part in my story, she was talking to someone else on the phone that gave her the info for the doctor's house. They had tracked it down as the owner of the apartment building that Ethan cut his finger off in. I'm guessing the guy she was talking to was some journalist contact. It still doesn't explain why she would just go alone to a potential killer's house.

As far as Scott going to that party, it seemed like he had some prior awareness that the guy was a little nuts. I have to assume that it goes back to his police days, but they really could have made it clear.

I left the creepy doctor's house as Madison after I found the club information, and I had no idea that things got that twisted if you stayed. Her death scene sounds really disturbing. Does the game just keep using her as a sex object every opportunity it gets?

[singlebanana]

I agree that Madison's character doesn't get developed well enough in this game and I think that much of the problem lies there.  It seems that they planned more development for her character, but much of it was cut. Why, who knows?  To learn a little more about it, I suggest watching this video that Shawn sent to Floyd and I, which show some of the very interesting stuff that was cut out of the game, including a small blurb about Madison. HOWEVER, DO NOT WATCH THIS VIDEO IF YOU HAVE NOT FINISHED THE GAME, MAJOR SPOILERS:

Spoiler (hover to show)

There are parts of Madison's character that I really like.  I really like that she is a bada@$ and seems to really be able to handle herself. She is also a beacon of light in a quite literal world of gloom for Ethan, a guy who has lost almost everything and is on the verge of losing it all.  I get that the writer's probably felt a "need" to put her in the game for this reason, but I think that a lack of backstory and some choices in her presentation objectify her character.  I really didn't see the need in some of the nude scenes, and quite frankly, using the motion controls to initiate a simulated sex scene made me feel very uncomfortable.  I was ultimately glad that I didn't have to actually simulate the act.......Geez.  I honestly don't hate or dislike her character, but I do feel that out of the four playable characters, she is the most ill-defined.

As far as the doctor's house goes, I thought that the scene was completely unnecessary and vulgar. And as we discuss on the podcast, what city has 4 serial killers living in it and acting at the same time?  And secondly, what are the odds of two of them being randomly connected?  The logic boggles the mind.  I thought this scene as merely added to create drama and tension, when in fact, it really just took away from the overall narrative.  Just to note, Madison was at the doctor's house because he owned the building where one of the trials took place and she was investigating to see if she could get the identity of the Origami Killer from him.

Unfortunately, Heavy Rain suffers a bit from poor decisions by the developers, especially their focus.  Some of you might have played the DLC Taxidermist episode (if not, DO NOT buy it).  It was the only additional episode that was released and more were planned, but the developers decided to focus on the Motion Controls instead.  It seems that they had some pretty cool episodes planned and that these would have helped to develop the characters more.  In the Taxidermist, we get a pre-Ethan scene where Madison is checking out a possible Origami Killer suspect.  This would lead us to infer that she is chasing this story prior to meeting Ethan.

[Pam]

I'm looking forward to the podcast, and I'll check out that video. It does get silly how many murderers there are in this game. I know the game is going for that noire vibe, but there's a big difference between "no good guys" and "everyone wants to murder everyone else." The chapter after Madison got killed by The Doctor I also got Norman killed by the guy at the junk yard.

[Duke.Togo]

First rule of Serial Killer Club....

Anyway, after I finish I am really curious to know if all the main characters can get killed off, and what happens at that point. I'm going to guess that the Origami Killer high-fives his other murder buddies at their clubhouse.

[singlebanana]

First rule of Serial Killer Club....

Anyway, after I finish I am really curious to know if all the main characters can get killed off, and what happens at that point. I'm going to guess that the Origami Killer high-fives his other murder buddies at their clubhouse.

Serial killers need friends too

[Duke.Togo]

I stayed up late and finished it. There was definitely one big surprise in there for me. I'll talk more after it's safe to do so.

[GrayGhost81]

I stayed up late and finished it. There was definitely one big surprise in there for me. I'll talk more after it's safe to do so.

IS IT SAFE?

[img width=600 height=347]http://1.images.spike.com/images/blogs/Movies/2011/06/07.jpg?quality=0.91[/img]

[singlebanana]

Well, November is over. Time to share your thoughts on the game and the ending.

[Pam]

Yay, I've been looking forward to discussing the end. The first time I played this game I got what I assume is the best ending - saved Sean, everyone (who wasn't a serial killer) lived, Ethan and Madison walked off into the sunset together. This time I was determined to screw things up. So:
- Madison got killed by the psycho killer doctor
- Norman got killed in the very next chapter by the psycho killer junkyard guy (he got crushed in the car compactor)
- Ethan was captured by the police at the hotel
- Scott didn't save Lauren and she drowned
- Sean died
- Origami killer went free

I ended up missing most of the chapters in the last quarter of the game because everyone was dead. I have a lot of thoughts though. The gameplay really takes a turn towards murder-heavy action in the last 3rd or so. I hate to use the phrase ludo-narrative dissonance, because it just sounds so pretentious, but I think this game is the poster child for it. At the start, the action makes sense. Ethan's challenges fit with the story, the occasional police//FBI chase fits, Scott getting into a fight or two is good (Madison's action scenes not so much, but nothing about her character is good). By the end though, everyone is out to murder you. The Doctor scene was unnecessary and excessive, the junkyard guy had killed before and now has no qualms about killing an FBI agent, the rich dude's dad tries to murder Scott and Lauren and then Scott just straight up murders 20 bodyguard-types who were just doing their job. Then, 2 minutes later it's supposed to be a difficult choice to let rich dad die by not giving him his medicine, after he says some truly heinous things about children being killed. The secondary villains are all such caricatures.

And this brings us to our primary villain - Scott. It makes no sense that he was the killer. Why was he investigating the killings? Just to get evidence back from the victim's families? The police didn't seem interested in any of it anyway. How did he manage to kill the clock shop guy without Lauren hearing anything? Why didn't he just kill his own worthless dad to get over his brother's death rather than more innocent kids? Or become a serial killer of other douchebag dads? I liked a lot of Scott's chapters but given the knowledge that he's the killer, none of them make sense.

In the end, Ethan was believed to be the origami killer and put in jail. He also seemed to believe he was the killer as he filled his cell with origami, before hanging himself.  Madison was talked about in a news broadcast, saying she was killed investigating the case (so the Doctor just put her body out where someone could find it? And how would anyone know she was investigating the case?). The jerk police officer put on Norman's AR glasses and was then greeted by Norman (what?). Scott walked free, who knows if he's going to kill more kids.

I liked playing this game but it's one where it's best to turn your brain off while playing. There are way too many glaring plot holes and poorly written characters.

[Duke.Togo]

I got the same "good" ending that Pam mentioned above. Even though I felt like I "won" I really didn't care a lot about the outcome for most of the characters. The weirdest part was Norman sitting at his desk with his VR glasses, then takes them off to rest his eyes. VR tanks come at him without the glasses on. WOAH, THE MATRIX HAS HIM. Also, the lame killer falls into the crusher bit at the end. Meh. I was just kind of glad to be done.

I didn't see the Scott as killer bit coming, so I give the game some points for that. I can see why he had to become a Private Eye after he left the police. While he was a police officer he could cover his own tracks, but when he retired he needed some way to clean up after himself. Again, I think he was still the best character in the game, even if he was a killer. I'm not sure if his feelings were genuine  towards Lauren, or just a way of keeping himself safe. I'm guessing the latter. The one thing that doesn't make much sense to me is the poison test. That was very elaborate and expensive. It didn't seem to me that Scott was a techie, so I'm not sure how he could afford to set all that up and broadcast it to himself. Also, what did he do with all the other dad's he murdered? Why didn't the police care at all about those deaths, or figure out the link to the Origami Killer kids? It would seem ridiculously suspicious that all the fathers disappeared right after their kids got killed. Am I to assume that most of the fathers just never tried to save their child? I agree with Pam, it would have made a lot more sense if he just went after other alcoholic loser dads. Lastly, the kid never thought about a straw or anything, eh? Seems like he had a lot of time to save his brother. Maybe brainstorm next time.

Ethan. Where to start? After I watched the video that Rich linked, he made a lot more sense to me. Without it he just doesn't make any sense at all. He magically warps to death scenes and makes origami animals when he blacks out? They could have made that figurative and it would have made more sense. Blacking out during the times of the murders could be enough to cause suspicion I suppose, so the story couldn't be worse than how it ended up. Also, since I didn't do it, it seems like you can find the address at the end from Madison, Ethan, and Norman. If you don't do any of the trials, could Ethan keep himself from getting beat up and finger amputated and still rescue Sean?

I don't have anything else to say about Madison that I didn't before. I liked Lauren as a character much more than her. They both were hanging out with crazies, but at least I understood Lauren's motivation.

What was the purpose of the rich guy and his son to the plot, other than to be a decoy? Why did Scott want to get involved with them at all? It just seemed to be a way to draw unwanted attention to himself. He obviously isn't going against them for moral reasons.

Overall, I think I had a decent time with the game for what it is, but like Pam said, it's best to just check your brain at the door. Enjoy the ride for what it is, and don't bother trying to make sense of it. Press X to Jason.

[Pam]

That's a good point about the fathers - no one made the connection between the kids getting kidnapped and the dads going missing?! Did the convenience store owner just not accept the killer's challenges or never open the figures to find the challenges? Seems like he was the only one not missing. The police were just totally incompetent. Why wouldn't they take the box of origami figures from the convenience store owner? It seems like a pretty key piece of evidence. And the suspects they had (other than Ethan) seemed to come out of nowhere.

I read some of the summaries of the chapters I missed this time around and was unfortunately reminded of the one where Madison has to strip at gunpoint for the club owner. How her character is used makes me so mad.

I just watched the video about the removed supernatural elements. A spiritual connection caused by witnessing Jason die seems a little tenuous, but I guess it makes a little more sense and I like that idea more than Ethan just being crazy. The game definitely would have benefited from the scenes mentioned with Madison going to her newspaper office, then she would at least give her a reason to be involved in the events of the game.