RF Generation Message Board

PARTICIPANTS:
Disposed Hero
Fleach
singlebanana

CHECKPOINTS:
Week 1: Travel to the volcano and defeat the "Pet Rock"
Week 2: Obtain the Diamond Eyes and defeat Aegis
Week 3: Defeat Mungola and restore peace to the kingdom
Week 4: Finish the game  ;D

HOW TO HEAL: The healing items at the beginning of the game are the petals (your character) and the biscuit (your dog); you will get better healing items and alchemy healing later. To access these, pull up your menu with the "Y" button. Then, press up on the D-Pad to access your items and select your healing item.

Are you kidding me?  I need to get my systems and games in order!  I love this game and would enjoy playing this again, unfortunately this is packed away. :(

Nope, not kidding at all. We announced this playthrough in August. ;)

I may have to play this... It was part of an RPG lot from Goodwill, and it's the only one I haven't played.

Love to have you aboard.

Alright, we're set!  Please let me know if you want to sign up. :D

I'm really looking forward to this one.  I beat Secret of Mana when I was a kid, and played the majority of it a couple of years ago in three player co-op.  I've tried to play Evermore a few times over the years (I even rented it when I was a kid), but I could never really get into it.  I've heard great things about the game though, so I'm sure it's just a matter of getting over that beginning hump and really settling into the game.  This playthrough will be the push I need to finally cross this game off my backlog list!

So I started playing around with the game this weekend. I was a little frustrated in that I did not know how to heal in the game, since I do not have a copy of the manual. It looks like others were having this issue online, so I thought I would go ahead and make a post about it here and put it up in the initial thread as well.

Healing - The healing items at the beginning of the game are the petals (your character) and the biscuit (your dog); you will get better healing items and alchemy healing later. To access these, pull up your menu with the "Y" button. Then, press up on the D-Pad to access your items and select your healing item.

First checkpoint is up! Let's get this party started.

Spent a little time in Evermore and made it to the first real boss.  I'm not sure if I'm under leveled or if I'm just not doing it right it, but I felt like I barely put a dent in that boss.  I'll have to try it again later.

The boss fights tend to be a little longer and more involved in this game. If you haven't started using alchemy yet, I highly suggest using it for that fight. You can do a ton of damage with it once you get the ribs to open.  Be sure to load up on gear in the village, and you may also want to change your stance to more offensive or defensive for the fight.

So I went back and did a little bit of grinding to get the money I needed to buy all the available armor (I had no armor previously) and also gained a couple of levels in the process, and then I was able to make short work of the boss.

This game had so much potential...and then they made it 1-player.

Secret of Mana was awesome with the 3 player play.  I would play with my mom and my brother.

Def. I've played it a million times with 2 player, but played it 3 player for the first time about a year ago. So much fun!

Evermore is still a very good game, but it could've been better if it was 2P. It also would've sold a lot more. They also made Seiken Densetsu 3 (Secret of Mana 2 - US) 2P instead of 3P!

I don't get it.

I don't think it only being a one player game is a big deal. Honestly, how many people would have actually sat down to play a 2 player RPG?  "Hey, I'm going to keep playing SoE..... Oh wait, I have to wait until Bobby gets home from class. *sigh*"  However, I do agree that they could have done some better things with that and the opportunity was there for it.

EDIT: Apparently, some people did like playing an RPG with others.  ;D


Just FYI, in case you don't know, this game has nothing to do with Secret of Mana. They share a somewhat similar title and menu system, but there is no story tie in.  As a result, many people didn't give SoE a fair shake when it came out; it was originally just going to be titled "Evermore."  Having never played SoE, I'll have a pretty unbiased opinion about the game, so that should make for some decent podcasting.

Well, where were you? Skipping school?! :)

I'm just saying it would've been nice to have the option. It couldn't have been that difficult to make it 2P. A lot of Seiken Densetsu 3 translation carts have the 3P option, so if a guy sitting in his house can do it (with no added cost to the game), I'd like to think Square could've done it.

The story might not be like SoM, but the game play is near identical. The way you move around, attack, run and switch characters is basically the same. 

Jerry's right.  Although there is no story tie-in, the mechanics of Evermore are practically identical to Mana.

I think many people consider Evermore to be a spiritual successor to Mana, and in many ways it is.  I'm not very far into Evermore yet, but so far I would say that it is inferior to Mana in literally every way.  That's not to say it's a bad game; I am enjoying it, and perhaps my nostalgia for Mana is coloring my opinion of it.  It's also possible that my opinion may change as I progress through the game.

I agree, but I think Secret of Mana is on a level of near perfection. I don't think it's nostalgia because I played both games when they came out and as a kid I remember being disappointed. Again, not to say that Evermore is bad, because it's not. It's very good and wish I was playing it with you guys (I never beat it). It just irks me when sequels (I know it's not a real sequel, but faiap, it is) discard awesome things from the original.

Maybe it's not nostalgia, but playing one game before the other is like watching a movie sequel, you're always, whether consciously or unconsciously, going to look for ways in which the 2nd doesn't match up to the first. (Lucky for A New Hope, there was The Empire Strikes Back...WHEW!).  It's inevitable. I'm not saying that SoM isn't better than SoE, since I haven't played the former and wouldn't know, but it will be nice for me to be able to judge SoE without having played it before. Now I'll just have a bias when I do play SoM. Ha ha!

On a current playthrough related note, I hit the first check point last night.

[img width=700 height=522]http://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y359/necrom99/Playthroughs/B1FDB352-34D7-4E32-8E89-3B8991A3B076_zpsn4o9yxji.jpg[/img]

Here are some of my current take aways on what I have already played:

1. Combat - One of the more frustrating aspects of combat from the start is the hit detection. At first, I was taking lots of damage because I was getting in too close and having a problem with the timing.  As I've played the game more, I've gotten more accustomed to enemy patterns and I'm making my way through the game much better.  Getting the spear and figuring out how to throw it (no manual...) was a big change in combat. Still, I really hate the hit bar and wish I could swing for full damage without waiting for it to charge.  To me, the hit bar doesn't really work well with the flow of this game.  There are games where the action bar works really well, one that comes to mind is Parasite Eve.

2. Graphics - Man, this game is f*$king beautiful!  I can't say enough about how good the game looks. The environments are rich and colorful, the sprites are nice and easily recognizable, and the bosses (the few I have battled so far) look extremely cool and are very detailed.

3. Boss battles - I think the boss battles have been well thought out so far in terms of strategies. However, bosses have an overabundant amount of HP and I know that the battle with the swamp snake took me well over 20 minutes to complete (and this was with using lots of magic and melee attacks).  This made the game frustrating at first, as I had a really tough time with the big bug battle (I think Steven did too).  Using a combination of attacks is best I find and doing a little grinding to make sure you have the best equipment, earn a few levels, and can fill up on alchemy materials works well. Money (talons in the first stage of the game) are pretty plentiful when taking out enemies and the "grinding" doesn't take long or feel cumbersome.

4. Magic vs. Melee - It took a while to figure out the alchemy and I'm not the biggest fan of this menu system when it comes to magic. I wish there was some way to map buttons to cast instead of having to stop the game and go into the menu each time.  Still, I think the game is pretty well balanced in terms of melee and magic and I like that not only you level up, but that your individual weapons and magic level up as well.

5. Backtracking - There is a little backtracking in the game, but none that I have come across yet is excessive. I don't mind this at all and actually think it's fun to figure out things like, "Oh, I remember seeing that cave covered with the rock. That is probably where I need to go next."

6. Puzzles/Mazes - I have to admit, one of the more frustrating aspects of the game are the labyrinth sections of the game.  Some areas are literally puzzles and with save points pretty far and in between some times, traversing back and forth through respawning enemies can get a bit hairy.  I got lost in the mud pepper swamp last night, and I almost pulled my hair out trying to figure out the water pipes below the volcano (took me probably 30-45 mins). If you want to keep your sanity, you might want to consult a walkthrough in this latter section...just sayin'.

Overall, I am enjoying this game.  I think that it's beautiful and really like the story very much; it's really unique and probably the main factor that is pushing me to want to finish this game (though there are other factors that aid in this as well).  Curious to hear other thoughts on these game features.

Damn, I never knew that.  I thought it was a direct sequel.

The 2nd checkpoint is up! :D

I haven't quite hit the first checkpoint yet, but I just

Spoiler (hover to show)

killed the giant snake boss and got the mud pepper.

I hate to keep bringing up SoM, but if you've played both games, you can't help but compare the two.  Something that bothers me about SoE is how drab everything looks.  The graphics are great on a technical level, but everything is so dark and gloomy, and the color palette is almost entirely made up of grays and browns.  SoM on the other hand is such a bright, colorful, and vibrant game.

And then there's the soundtrack... or lack thereof.  Most of the areas in the game have ambient sound effects in the background rather than any actual melody playing, and most of the actual music I've heard so far in the game hasn't been all that great.  SoM on the other hand....

I'm going to have to apologize in advance Rich.  Our podcast segment on this game is probably just going to be mostly me comparing SoE to SoM.

Played through the 2nd checkpoint last night.

I just passed the first checkpoint and made it to the next area.  I walked outside the town and nearly got killed by the first enemy I saw.  Fortunately I found the dude selling armor in town, so now I'm better equipped and can hopefully take more than a couple of hits from these new enemies.

Yep, armor upgrading is a pretty essential part of this game.  Though you can choose to skip enemies, it's not a very wise decision, since upgrading your character, your weapons, and your alchemy are all very beneficial as well. If you take the time to defeat enemies as you go, it pays off and makes the game much easier as you go through it.  I like to target multiple with the alchemy as I grind.  My only gripe with the weapons is that you have to re-level them each time you get a new one...

I crossed the desert and reached the large town with the marketplace.  It seems like there's some sort of trading mini-game going on here.  Did you do that Rich?  Anybody know if the final reward is worthwhile?

Yes, I did this. The marketplace is timed (12 minutes I think). It's a good place to upgrade your armor, especially if you know what you are doing. I don't think that there is any type of special event, just if you are quick enough, you can upgrade your armor well before you head out to the pyramids.  I think I grabbed all of the armor in time, just didn't bother with the other stat upgrade items.  After the 12 minutes or so, the market closes and no one will sell you anything. You then have to move to the next event in town.  After you return from the pyramids and finish in town, the market will open up again and allow you to get the items you might have missed.

Along with armor, be sure to grab about 3-4 Amulets of Annihilation. You can use these to pay the "Ferry Rowboatsman" to take you across the desert so that you don't have to run back through it (annoying).

The scarab is a tough market item to find, you have to go right out of the market to the right and go through a building on the next screen and back into the market to get to a few traders.

Let me know if you have any other questions. I put up the rest of the checkpoints today and am almost to the 3rd after another push last night. ;)  I understand how it's hard to not compare this game to SoM and we will certainly talk about it, but it certainly shouldn't be something we drone on and on about.  I find myself really enjoying this game, and if SoM is anything like it (as you all say it is), I'm positive I'd enjoy that as well.  I hate that the price tag is so high and would prevent us from doing a playthrough (unless there is enough interest of course).

Wow, didn't realize it was timed.  I'll probably just look up a guide to make sure I do it right.

I'll try to go easy on the SoM comparisons.  I think I've made all the comparisons that I felt were necessary for now.  For our podcast segment, I'll look over your outline and pick and choose my moments.  You could easily compare every aspect of these two games, and I'm probably going to have to bite my tongue regarding most of them, but I understand that's not the point of this playthrough or podcast.

There's another marketplace scene later in the game, but thankfully, it's not complicated. When I first saw it, I facepalmed.

I have guests coming into town tonight who will be around for a few days, so I decided to make another push last night with the game.  I am now through the 3rd checkpoint and hope to get back to finishing the game sometime this upcoming weekend.  If anyone gets stuck or has questions about the game, let me know.

I finished the Coliseum and did the marketplace thing (with minimal use of a guide).  I went to the Pyramid but got stuck, so I decided to go to the Hall of Collosia instead which is where I last saved.

I feel like the more I play this game, the more I like it.

I'm happy to hear this.  I've really enjoyed this game myself.  The combat took me a little while to get use to, but once I did, I haven't have many problems. I spammed Crush on "multiple" throughout those pyramids. Kind of cheap, but it allows you to keep moving without much damage or direct combat and it helps you level up the spell for tougher battles latter. I gotta admit, I spam it every boss fight.

It seems that money in this game is always plentiful and I haven't had any problems (except for the very beginning) purchasing equipment. Every time I am at an alchemy mat dealer, I just fill up on whatever I'm not maxed out in.  While it makes the game easier, limitless materials makes the game a little too easy and pretty much negates searching for mats  later in the game.

Just got both of the diamond eyes last night.

It seems like our play styles are drastically different.  Other than Heal, I really haven't been using alchemy at all.  I've found physical attacks to be more than sufficient for taking out enemies, even bosses.  It helps that my dog's level 3 charge attack is doing ~400 damage per hit.

I've also had an abundance of money in the game.  Cost of living is apparently cheaper in SoE, because I was always broke and needed to grind for money in SoM.  :P

Yeah, my dog is hitting for 500-600+ right now. Talk about an OP companion.  I find that the more you crank up his attack rate, the less you really have to worry about in the game other than healing him. The various collars also raise his defense so much, that most of the damage he takes (except magic) is always -20 HP. Sometimes I have to lower his rate just to be able to level up my weapons.

Spamming alchemy pretty much puts the game into breeze mode, but I'm not going to complain about shorter fights and a quicker finish. :D


Wait.............. are you telling me that there is something in this game better than SoM?? Ha ha!

Pushed through to just past 1 AM last night and struggling heavily today, but here be the fruits.....the fruits mannnn, the fruits!

[img width=700 height=522]http://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y359/necrom99/Playthroughs/A53475A5-8789-48A7-A728-ABA65F8F2D5E_zpsregsupeh.jpg[/img]

[img width=700 height=522]http://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y359/necrom99/Playthroughs/3FCB43E6-5FE3-45AC-89C0-7C0C9AD0EAE3_zpsu1odrszg.jpg[/img]

[img width=700 height=522]http://i1029.photobucket.com/albums/y359/necrom99/Playthroughs/A125CD8B-ED21-4CFA-B1AD-7C861CF763B4_zpsisllljs4.jpg[/img]

^ That's amazing detail on that screenshot. Parking meters, fire hydrant, sale sign, gutter, street litter, sidewalk cracks, the windows even have different glare and items inside.

Was a lot of the game like this?

What did you guys think of the music and graphics?

I might have to get this game again.

Yes, I thought the entire game was very highly detailed. Maybe not always to the extent you see in the picture, but very close. As far as the music goes....well, let's save that for the podcast. ;)

We are recording the Secret of Evermore podcast tonight. Is there anything that any of you would like us to discuss?  We will certainly talk about the music and graphics Jerry. :)

Personally, I'm just interested to hear more about the game. I didn't give it a fair shake as a kid because it wasn't Secret of Mana 2. Also, it came out pretty late in the SNES time line and at that time I was probably way more into PlayStation.

I looked at it's Wiki page to see when it was released and I read the Reception part. I don't want it to influence your views, but here it is if you're interested.

Spoiler (hover to show)

Secret of Evermore received positive reviews from most media outlets. Most publications praised its graphics. For instance, RPGFan called the game a "wonderful visual experience," applauding its use of color, animation, and background.[8] Zachary Lewis of RPGamer noted that the locales found in Secret of Evermore were detailed in a much more realistic way than other games of the genre.[15] GamePro was complimentary of its American art-style, but longed for the Japanese art found in other Square titles.[44] Another highlight for many critics was gameplay, particularly aspects also found in Secret of Mana such as the ring menu.[6][8][39]

Reviewers were more critical concerning the game's sound. Although the musical score was appreciated for its overall quality, both RPGFan and RPGamer found that there were too few adequately long tracks, with mediocre ambient sound effects to fill the dead time.[8][15] Critics were mixed on the issue of Secret of Evermore being the first game developed by Square in the United States. Super Play found that the game was not up to the standards held by other Square games.[43] Others noted that Secret of Evermore was a decent first attempt by the American team. GamePro dubbed the game "worthy of a sequel," while Game Players anticipated another game from the same development team.